Other ways to get in or out
#1
I am not 100% sure the killer went in or out the basement window.  Especially if he had been in the house more than once.    Here from Steve Thomas' deposition is information on other ways the killer might have gone in.

Q. There was clearly an indication from a member of the Boulder Police Department that they found
at least seven doors and windows unlocked at the Ramsey home on the morning of December 26,
1996. You remember that, don't you?

A. I've heard that referred to. I don't know -- what detective are you referring to?
Q. Have you heard that, sir? Has that not been part of a presentation made to you?
A. By Lou Smit or Mr. DeMuth?
Q. Either one.
A. What presentation are you talking about?
Q. There were two presentations, one in May and one in June. You attended both, true?
A. I did.
Q. You took notes, didn't you?
A. I may have.
Q. You paid careful attention to what was being said, didn't you?
A. I believe so.
Q. Have you ever heard that there were seven windows and doors found unlocked in the Ramsey
home on the morning of December 26, 1996?
A. I don't know who the source of that is right now but I --
Q. I didn't ask you the source. I asked you have you ever heard it, sir?
A. Yeah.
MR. DIAMOND: Have you heard that from any source?
A. Yeah.
Q. (BY MR. WOOD) From someone connected with the investigation, either in the district
attorney's office or the Boulder Police Department?
A. Or courtesy of you and the media, yeah, I believe I've heard that.
Q. Trust me, I wasn't there the morning of the 26th and I didn't find the status of the doors. I'm
asking you whether --
A. Nor was I, no.
Q. And I don't think I was around in May or June when the presentations were made. You heard
that a Boulder police officer had found as many as seven doors and windows unlocked in that house on
the morning of December 26, 1996, hadn't you, sir?
A. You're sourcing that to a -- now to a Boulder police officer detective and that's not my
recollection; DeMuth may have said that.
Q. Do you think Trip DeMuth made it up out of a whole cloth?
A. I don't know where Trip DeMuth uncovered a lot of things in his investigation.
Q. So you think that there was -- you feel like you can competently say that's not true, that there
were no doors found unlocked or windows found unlocked that morning?
A. I wasn't there that morning.
Q. Well, sir, you were not but you have to rely, as you say earlier in your testimony, on your fellow
officers, right?
A. That's right.
Q. All right. Well, did you go back and ever look to see if there were ever any reports that would
have indicated that there were as many as seven windows and doors found unlocked in that house that
morning?
A. I'm not familiar with the detective or the report you're speaking about.
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#2
jameson
Charter Member
11546 posts
May-29-03, 09:28 PM (EST)
 
1. "RE: Thomas depo 20 - unlocked doors and "
In response to message #0
 
  
Boulder put out a press release in January of 1997 that revealed the "Midnight Burglar" - a problem Boulder had - - a burglar who went in Boulder houses in December - - he wasn't heard from after Christmas, 1996. Hmmmmm.
In January of 1998, there was another Boulder press release asking residents to PLEASE be more security conscious - lock doors and windows.
Boulder "feels safe" - - the residents just didn't want to ccept that it was not.
The Ramseys didn't get the benefit of either of those press releases - - they had already lost their daughter.
In the beginning, the public was told the house had been secure, that there was no evidence of entry. Now we known either of those statements was true.
This is important to understanding the case - - the BORG myth must be exposed. I am glad it came out in the deposition, verified what we already knew.


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Islander
unregistered user
May-29-03, 10:20 PM (EST)
 
2. "RE: Thomas depo 20 - unlocked doors and"
In response to message #1
 
  
I read in the NE The Police Files that John Fernie claimed that the butler kitchen door to the outside was open when he arrived at the house early on the morning of December 26. Has that been determined to be true and, if so, has it been determined that the first police on the scene were not responsible for opening it?
Lou Smit doesn’t focus much on this door as an intruder point of entry, but I think I read where he allows for the possibility that the door was used as an intruder exit point. That seems reasonable to me, especially if the door had a sticker on it indicating it was alarm protected. Once inside the house, an intruder would be able to see from the security alarm control panel that the system was not activated. An intruder could then choose any exit point he wished without fear of setting of the security alarm. The suitcase under the window could have been a back-up emergency plan had the Ramseys found JB to be missing while he was still in the basement with her.


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jameson
Charter Member
11546 posts
May-29-03, 10:27 PM (EST)
 
3. "RE: Thomas depo 20 - unlocked doors and"
In response to message #2
 
  
That door was normally locked and unused - - after the murder, a reporter told me he had jimmied that lock and gotten in fairly easily, though. I don't know if he told the cops, but I did report that later.
On the 26th, Fernie said he found that door open - and Scott Gibbons reported the same thing - - so two people reported seeing the door wide open. But I see a problem - - the cops were there before Fernie - - and I believe before Gibbons saw it. So I would really like to hear from the cops exactly what they did before depending on the information pointing to an intruder leaving that way.
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#3
(03-25-2017, 12:07 PM)jameson245 Wrote: I am not 100% sure the killer went in or out the basement window.  Especially if he had been in the house more than once.    Here from Steve Thomas' deposition is information on other ways the killer might have gone in.

Q. There was clearly an indication from a member of the Boulder Police Department that they found
at least seven doors and windows unlocked at the Ramsey home on the morning of December 26,
1996. You remember that, don't you?
Steve Thomas conveniently forgot that little info anytime he was "investigating".  To me, that should have been a lightbulb in his head! So many different possibles where the killer really could have entered. I can see him going into the house through the window, but after he killed JonBenet, he had to place the ransom note... so he probably exited another way.
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#4
Woodward book

John Fernie found the Butlers door open at 6 am and the same door was reported to be open at 8 am by Scott Gibbons, the neighbor to the north.

My comment - I would like to see those police reports, the first is something I have heard before and believe to be true. But by 8 am there were people and cops and - - an open door in winter with an investigation going on? I am having problems with that one.
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#5
(03-26-2017, 03:48 PM)jameson245 Wrote: Woodward book

John Fernie found the Butlers door open at 6 am and the same door was reported to be open at 8 am by Scott Gibbons, the neighbor to the north.

My comment - I would like to see those police reports, the first is something I have heard before and believe to be true. But by 8 am there were people and cops and - - an open door in winter with an investigation going on? I am having problems with that one.


I noticed that too in the Book. Never heard this before this book came out!
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#6
Another find in the Woodward book - page 192.

The French Door that can be seen in many of the photos of the grate - it is to the right and opened into the formal dining room - - was AJAR - - no signed of forced entry but it was not actually closed.

Interesting and she says it is in report #1-59
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#7
More on the Fernie discovery of the North side Butler's door being open.

John Fernie noted the door was open about a foot - and that was at about 6:01. "found the butler kitchen door standing open about one foot while it was still dark outside and before the evidence team or Detective Arndt arrived." (BPD reports #1-1490 and #1-1315)
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#8
According to police report 1-100, Scott Gibbons described that door facing his house to be "approximately 1/3 of the way open when he saw it" - which would have been closer to 8 am.

(I am confused about this but reporting what I have found in the Woodward book. I would love to see those reports and speak to the officers who made them.)
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#9
John Fernies words are HUGE!!!!!!!
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